Wednesday, August 05, 2009, 6:55 PM
Opinion, Politics
By Stephanie Ramage
IS THE POLICE FOUNDATION SHILLING FOR COUSINS PROPERTIES?
There’s been a lot of talk among mayoral candidates lately about helping police officers live in the city of Atlanta. One local organization that says it has helped police officers find affordable housing is the Atlanta Police Foundation.
Checking it out recently, I clicked the link for “In-City Housing” on the APF’s website and saw a banner that reads: “Affordable homes in the Beltline TAD -- new income limits cover most APD officers.” http://www.atlantapolicefoundation.org/Programs/InCityHousing.aspx
Instinctively, I then clicked on the police foundation’s “board” link where John S. McColl, senior vice president of Cousins Properties, is listed as chairman of the board. Is there a connection between Cousins and the Beltline?
According to a July 18, 2005 Atlanta Journal-Constitution article, there is: “The Beltline -- Atlanta's biggest proposed project in recent history -- is being steered by a political and business network closely connected to one of the city's premier developers, Tom Cousins, the founder of Cousins Properties Inc.” the AJC reported, and continued, “Cousins' son-in-law, for example, is president of the Atlanta Development Authority, the agency that Mayor Shirley Franklin put in the driver's seat of the campaign for the proposed Beltline and the creation of a special tax district to pay for it.”
That would be the tax district the police foundation’s website is touting for police officers moving into Atlanta.
(It should be noted that mayoral candidate Lisa Borders is a former senior vice president at Cousins, too.)
Should the foundation be steering police recruits toward housing in a TAD with connections to its chairman?
Yellow f'ing Lazarus.
Have you bothered to even figure out whether Cousins Properties owns any land or buildings near the Beltline? The answer is no.
Also, is Greg Giornelli - the Cousins son-in-law you mention - still associated with ADA? No. Giornelli is now working for the City as COO. For those who don't know, the ADA is independent from city gov't.
Is Tom Cousins even still chairman of Cousins Properties? No.
You are a joke and an embarrassment to journalism.
Beyond the remarkably shoddy "reporting," you also have no basis to suggest that John McColl's commitment as chair of the Police Foundation is based on anything other than his commitment to supporting APD officers. Something you supposedly also feel strongly about.
Finally, could you please stop writing everything in first person? If you're going to pretend to be a journalist, then pretend to write like one too.
Mr. T
Wednesday, August 05, 2009 at 9:17 PM
Yes, your ramblings are on par with The Atlantic or The New Yorker. So sorry for not making the connection. Please point out to me where their writers so thoroughly show their "professional" side as you have in your response.
I look forward to you actually proving Cousins involvement with the Beltline, not making fact-free insinuations to support your anti-Beltline stance. And by proof, I mean something a rational person would recognize, NOT crazy cabal talk. Perhaps something like Cousins owns this piece of land along the Beltline or has otherwise made a move to take advantage of this proposed project.
Otherwise, I stand by my characterization of this as yellow pseudo-journalism.
Mr. T
Wednesday, August 05, 2009 at 11:10 PM
Thanks for deleting your response. Proves my point in a way i never could. Lazarus.
Mr. T
Wednesday, August 05, 2009 at 11:20 PM
Oops, I hit "delete" instead of "post." It's late. But, I'll reconstruct my comment so you don't look so silly:
"Ah, well Mr. T., at last I know who you are. Thank you.
1) Ever read The New Yorker? The Atlantic? Some of the best damn journalism on earth and the vast majority of it is the first person. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIi i i i i i i i iI I I I II I I IIIIII
All that aside however, this is my blog. It's my online column. I can "I" until the Beltline is actually built.
2) Is there a relationship between the Beltline and Cousins Properties? Clearly there is. The fact that Giornelli is now COO for the City of Atlanta establishes a closer link between the Beltline and Cousins than I did. Do you have any idea how many projects the city is hanging on the Beltline? I wish I'd thought of that connection. Again, thank you.
3) I wasn't suggesting that McColl feels anything other than a commitment to police officers. I was suggesting that an organization might feel some pressure to please the chairman of its board over something Atlanta's time-honored cabal of developer/politicos stand to make a profit on. Why else push anyone toward the boondoggle that we all know the Beltline to be?
Now go back to the Loaf where what passes for your intellect might be appreciated. Do it because I I I I I I I I I I said so.
Stephanie Ramage"
And I'll leave out that insensitive last part.
Now, here's what I wanted to post which would come after your second post:
The connection between Beltline and chairman could very well be a mere coincidence. But does it look good for a foundation to be promoting projects connected to its chairman? No.
Is there a relationship between Cousins and the Beltline? Yes. Cousins was an early booster for launching the Beltline.
The ADA, for its part, actually created the TAD. Now, Giornelli is the city's COO.
Is the police foundation's website promoting housing opportunities in the Beltline TAD? Yes.
Is the chairman of the foundation a senior vice president of Cousins? Yes.
Stephanie
Wednesday, August 05, 2009 at 11:31 PM
By the way, what is this garbage you posted?
"Have you bothered to even figure out whether Cousins Properties owns any land or buildings near the Beltline? The answer is no."
How would you or anyone else know that? The Beltline parcel buy-up isn't complete. Don't spout what you don't know and can't prove as if it is fact.
Stephanie
Wednesday, August 05, 2009 at 11:44 PM
Let me help...here's how journalists do it:
You want to investigate - rather than simply make casual inferences - whether Cousins Properties is involved in any way with the Beltline.
1) You look at the BeltLine leaders. Here's the Beltline Partnership TAD Advisory Board.
http://www.beltline.org/BeltLineBasics/CommunityEngagement/TaxAllocationDistrictAdvisoryCommittee/tabid/1779/Default.aspx
Nothing there. How about Atlanta BeltLine Inc Board?
http://www.beltline.org/AboutUs/ABIBoardofDirectors/tabid/1699/Default.aspx
Nope, no Cousins. Okay Let's do a little more work.
2) You know that a developer like Cousins only stands to benefit directly from the Belltline if it controls tracts of land it can develop along it.
Let's take the proposed, clearly defined Beltline path - these are the tracts slated for purchase:
http://www.beltline.org/Portals/26/project_overview_062008.pdf
Now match it up with Cousins' property holdings, which are easily available because Cousins is a public company:
http://yahoo.brand.edgar-online.com/displayfilinginfo.aspx?FilingID=6445357-69670-202768&type=sect&dcn=0000950144-09-001718
All you have to do is look at what Cousins owns and try to match it up with the Beltline. There's nothing there. Cousins owns nothing near the Beltline.
3) So, you're a little stymied now not being able to make a direct connection. Maybe go back and look through the archives at AJC or the Business Chronicle and see if any Cousins execs have ever even talked about the Beltline.
But you search and search and find that the only connections made between Cousins and the Beltline are being made by journalists. Cousins has never owned any land near the Beltline nor has it announced anything remotely resembling plans to develop near the Beltline.
4) Undaunted by the lack of any actual evidence, you accept as fact an incredibly circumstantial piece of four-year-old "journalism" as proof of the Cousins/Beltline connection. All so you can suggest that John McColl and the Police Foundation are underhandedly suggesting cops consider subsidized housing that may be a part of a project that we all know is light years away.
Irresponsible is a kind word for what you're doing. If I were John McColl or the Police Foundation, I might consider it slander. Or is it libel?. I can never recall. But they have lots of lawyers to figure that out.
And I doubt you know who I am. But if you do, you know I do not and have never written for Creative Loafing. I am just a former and future journalist who happens to know a hell of a lot about real estate.
And just because you call it a blog, you are not absolved from reporting responsibly and doing the work all journalists should. Own it, Lazarus.
Mr. T
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 9:01 AM
Mr. T,
Clearly you're not a journalist, or even a reader for that matter. If you were, you'd know how fast parcels change hands (you may recall that Wayne Mason bought his parcels at about $20 million and managed to sell them again, this time to the Beltline, only 3 years later for $66 million). You'd also know that the county deed books lag behind such purchases. You'd also know that relying on the developers themselves to report what they own is kind of like relying on AIG not to overpay its executives.
The "four year old" data remains a clear indication of who's involved with the Beltline and who has a financial stake in its success. The same developers have been behind every public-private development partnership in Atlanta for the past 20 years and I don't expect that to change anytime soon. -- SR
Stephanie
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 9:23 AM
That $20 million should be $25 million.
Stephanie
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 9:27 AM
I know quite well why you are a "former" journalist.
Stephanie
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 9:29 AM
If you know so much about real estate, you'd also know that I could buy a parcel of Beltline land and never have my name appear on the documents. I've done enough research on property ownership to know how many layers you have to go through in come cases to find who's actually behind a corporation's name.
Stephanie
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 9:37 AM
Yeah, you really got me there. Me: "Please cite facts." You: "My opinions are facts. I believe this is true, so it is." Crazier than a football bat.
Mr. T
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 9:41 AM
But you're not citing facts.
You're saying Cousins doesn't own any land on or near the Beltline, but you can't prove it for reasons that I have clearly laid out.
What we do know beyond any shadow of a doubt has been well reported by David Pendered at the AJC: Cousins Properties was the power behind launching the Beltline.
Stephanie
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 9:45 AM
Okay, birther logic. I also can't prove Obama wasn't born in Kenya. All i can do is rely on the facts as they are publicly disclosed. Silly me.
Mr. T
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 9:58 AM
Ms. Ramage,
I hope that someone who can tie her own shoes, etc., understands enough about logic to know that the onus is on you, the one making an argument based on zero facts, to justify and provide proof for your position.
The responsibility is yours, not on anyone else to prove the converse of your accusation.
Hope this helps.
Thomas
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 12:44 PM
I merely stated the facts.
1) The police foundation is steering recruits toward buying housing in the Beltline TAD.
2)The foundation's chairman is a senior VP at Cousins Properties.
3) Cousins took the lead in launching the Beltline.
Stephanie
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 12:52 PM
Those facts don't really lead to any sort of logical conclusion, unless you're a conspiracy theory nutcase.
You could at least TRY to investigate whether Cousins owns Beltline land, or is even thinking about it. Complaining that it's too hard is a clear concession that you'd rather depend on weak innuendo.
Perhaps a call to a Cousins spokesperson could at least get you a non-denial denial, just out of fairness. Who knows, Cousins may even be able to help you clear up some of the gaps in your knowledge.
Joe
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 1:25 PM
Mr. T/Thomas/Joe (since you're all the same person). I never said it was too hard. I said, and this is a fact like all the other facts I've presented, the Beltline parcel buy up is not complete yet, and if you think that Cousins doesn't have a dog in the Beltline fight, you're painfully stupid, willfully ignorant, or knowingly lying to yourself and others. Now, unlike you, I have a lot to do. So, I'll get back to it now. Cheers.
Stephanie
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 1:32 PM
I agree that the reasoning behind this post is pretty tenuous. But "Mr. T" is equally stretching in alleging slander, libel, etc. Where's the slander?
Plus, if you're going to call someone out for being disingenuous, why not admit who you really are?
Is it a coincidence that
http://twitter.com/andishehnouraee is agitating about this post on Twitter, and yet not in the comments on this page? One way to prove it.
Anthony
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 1:36 PM
There's an awful lot of smoke here for very little fire. That applies to both the original post and the accusations made by "Mr. T."
Anthony
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 1:45 PM
Dear Whomever-
I always use my full name (or at least my entire first name) when I leave comments on web sites or blogs.
I have made no attempt to conceal my contempt for Ms. Ramage's questionable professional and personal ethics. I've written about it openly on my own blog.
http://tinyurl.com/kjnexy
Andisheh Nouraee
andy@andy2000.org
Andisheh
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 1:55 PM
Wow, you guys have really gotten far afield from the blog post in your zeal to attack me.
Here is the post once again. There is no slander. There is no libel. There is merely a question and it is obviously a question that some people wish I hadn't asked:
Should the foundation be steering police recruits toward housing in a TAD with connections to its chairman?
IS THE POLICE FOUNDATION SHILLING FOR COUSINS PROPERTIES?
There’s been a lot of talk among mayoral candidates lately about helping police officers live in the city of Atlanta. One local organization that says it has helped police officers find affordable housing is the Atlanta Police Foundation.
Checking it out recently, I clicked the link for “In-City Housing” on the APF’s website and saw a banner that reads: “Affordable homes in the Beltline TAD -- new income limits cover most APD officers.” http://www.atlantapolicefoundation.org/Programs/InCityHousing.aspx
Instinctively, I then clicked on the police foundation’s “board” link where John S. McColl, senior vice president of Cousins Properties, is listed as chairman of the board. Is there a connection between Cousins and the Beltline?
According to a July 18, 2005 Atlanta Journal-Constitution article, there is: “The Beltline -- Atlanta's biggest proposed project in recent history -- is being steered by a political and business network closely connected to one of the city's premier developers, Tom Cousins, the founder of Cousins Properties Inc.” the AJC reported, and continued, “Cousins' son-in-law, for example, is president of the Atlanta Development Authority, the agency that Mayor Shirley Franklin put in the driver's seat of the campaign for the proposed Beltline and the creation of a special tax district to pay for it.”
That would be the tax district the police foundation’s website is touting for police officers moving into Atlanta.
(It should be noted that mayoral candidate Lisa Borders is a former senior vice president at Cousins, too.)
Should the foundation be steering police recruits toward housing in a TAD with connections to its chairman?
Stephanie
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 2:02 PM
For the record, my name is Joe Winter. I generally post comments on blogs as "Joeventures." I maintain the domain joeventures.com.
When I registered for this site, I entered the field marked, "Display Name" as "Joeventures." Clearly, that had no bearing on how my name would be displayed in the comments here.
I may not be a journalist, but at least I can say I passed the "Critical Thinking" course in college.
Joe
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 2:07 PM
Andisheh,
My "personal ethics"? What on earth are you talking about? You and I don't even know each other personally. I might see you once in a great while over by DeKalb Ave. when you're walking your dogs. We bumped into each other once at The Dancing Goats coffee shop.
I can literally count the number of times I've seen you on one hand. I know nothing about your personal life and would never be so foolish or dishonest as to suggest anything of any sort about your personal ethics.
If you're going to comment on my personal life, first I'd like to know what makes you any kind of judge of it, and second, is this the place for that sort of thing?
How desperate are you for attention? -- Steph
Stephanie
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 2:12 PM
So your question is "Should the foundation be steering police recruits toward housing in a TAD with connections to its chairman?" If the chairman was not connected to Cousins but just lived in the TAD area, will that generate the same concern? No, of course not. You are insinuating that chairman and Cousins will reap some sort of benefit or profit. The problem is that you have nothing else to show other than conjecture, assumptions and speculation. You raise a question that you have no intention of following up and resolving. I think we can call this an example of drive-by "reporting". But this is a blog, new media rules must apply.l
Denis
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 2:12 PM
In response to: "Should the foundation be steering police recruits toward housing in a TAD with connections to its chairman?"
My answer is, I have no problem with that.
And in response to the title of this post, my answer is, you've not adequately demonstrated that any shilling is going on. Frankly, your claim of innocence ("merely a question") is laughable. Your intentions are quite clear here.
Joe
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 2:16 PM
Again, simple logic: If you truly think I am posting under more than one user name, simply check the IP address, and you'll see that I live in Texas. And no, I'm not using a proxy (they all go through Latvia or Bulgaria or something along those lines).
I can see the confusion (Mr. T and Thomas both use the obscure letter "t"), but I actually used the display name of Thomas Aquinas, and it's displaying only the first name, Thomas. To clarify, I am also not a 13th century saint.
Cheers.
Thomas
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 2:20 PM
According to Webster's New World College Dictionary, a shill is a person who "works energetically to sell or promote something." The police foundation has a highlighted banner that reads “Affordable homes in the Beltline TAD -- new income limits cover most APD officers.”
Stephanie
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 2:23 PM
Or it could mean, as you clearly used the word, "a decoy who acts as an enthusiastic customer in order to stimulate the participation of others"
http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=shill
Joe
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 2:35 PM
Thank you Denis for crystalizing my thoughts succinctly. I can get long winded.
Also, thanks to the others (Joe and Thomas) for dispatching that silly same name business.
Although it should be noted that Stephanie herself is an artist at it, having done it on her own blog under the name Lazarus to settle an old score with former Loaf editor Ken Edelstein.
And no I'm not Andisheh, as crazy brains could figure out very simply by checking our IP addresses. But I do know Andisheh and he's good people.
Mr. T
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 2:39 PM
Dear Stephanie-
Since you don't seem to have a problem with loaded questions, try this one: have you ever used the pseudonym "Lazarus" when leaving comments on any of Sunday Paper's pages?
Your answer (or lack of one) will reveal your professional and personal ethics.
You're right. I barely know you. So what.
I somehow doubt you spend a lot of time with the people you smear in the above post.
I'm judging your professional and personal ethics based on your work, and the series of e-mails posted here: http://tinyurl.com/kjnexy
If a developer is using the APF to make money, that'd be news. But you don't have an shred of evidence -- no smoke or fire.
And if attention's what I'm after, don't you think I'd post this where it's more likely to be seen?
Andisheh Nouraee
andy@andy2000.org
Andisheh
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 2:41 PM
"And if attention's what I'm after, don't you think I'd post this where it's more likely to be seen?"
Sorry Andisheh, but your heated posts on twitter says otherwise. But to be clear, I am totally on your side in this debate. The blog entry was shoddy at best.
Denis
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 2:52 PM
"You raise a question that you have no intention of following up and resolving. I think we can call this an example of drive-by "reporting". But this is a blog, new media rules must apply.l"
Please don't tar us all with this ugly brush.
James
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 3:03 PM
WTF! That's not the display name I selected. This is some weird ass commenting software.
~griftdrift
James
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 3:05 PM
Sorry, I was being mildly sarcastic and did not mean to imply a generality. I am a big fan of Drifing through the Grift.
Denis
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 3:26 PM
Really? All the other blogs posted and this one gets so much attention from as far away as Texas?!? Priorities are very very interesting. The police are so underpaid that they will qualify for this assistance program. City is considering making them exempt from property tax. All in an attempt to make the city safer. I honestly doubt officers will bring thier families to the city and subject them to the revolving door uncaring court system that is the city of atlanta and fulton county. And does the council really want the police to have a large voting concern here where they would certainly turn out in mass? I seriously doubt this. They could make it mandatory for new hires to live in the city limits, as many places do, but that would mean a lot of changes here that they refuse to do. Maybe the current rate of high profile crimes will turn enough peoples heads for at least long enough to effect the election, but given the short attention span of most, I doubt it.
rob
Thursday, August 06, 2009 at 4:06 PM
Thanks, Rob, for bringing us back to what is important. My concern, the concern that drove me to post this blog entry and the one that guides much of my writing, is that the police are once again being used for the benefit of the City of Atlanta’s officials and their cronies. If that is not the case, it is not the case, but I have the same right, as any citizen does, to ask a question about something that doesn’t look right to me.
The political relationship between the city government and developers cannot and should not be discounted. Equally important is the city’s historic use of the police department to balance its books. When these two factors are taken together, my worry regarding cops being channeled toward the Beltline TAD is more than justified.
What is particularly sad about Andisheh Nouraee’s obsession with a blog comment made in November 2008 (here is the thing to which he is referring, http://www.sundaypaper.com/More/Archives/tabid/98/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/3375/Default.aspx) is that if Nouraee, who is a columnist for our ailing competitor, Creative Loafing, had devoted half as much passion and dedication to covering a local issue as he has to that comment, the local issue probably would have been resolved by now.
What is particularly sad about Creative Loafing’s role in this is that it used to be the paper that could always sniff out when developers were using some supposedly civic-minded project to promote their own interests. It did a better job of exposing those scenarios than any publication I have ever seen. I am, as most folks know, a former Creative Loafing staff writer, but I usually didn’t cover development so I’m certainly not talking about myself.
Today’s CL, however, is the biggest booster of the Beltline in Atlanta’s media.
The Sunday Paper takes no position on the Beltline. I, for the record, am not a fan of the Beltline. When I consider the many millions of dollars that have been sunk into it, the vast quantities of media attention and public energy that have been expended on it, I feel sick to my stomach. However inspiring Ryan Gravel’s dream is, and it is, the fact is that Atlanta has desperately needed those resources for the basics: police, fire, garbage pick up, maintained streets, and a reliable and efficient water system. However much its fans cheer that the Beltline has fed on private money, their jubilation is produced by ignoring how much the city has outright given developers by exonerating them from taxes and fees over and over again. The city hasn’t even collected impact fees on many of the projects going on within it. That is money that could have been put to much better use in the here and now rather than on a transit loop that won’t be completed for 25 years. If transit is the issue, then expanding MARTA would be a much smarter way to go.
A TAD is an exercise in indebtedness. According to the Atlanta Development Authority, in a TAD “Redevelopment costs are financed through the pledge of future incremental increases in property taxes generated by the resulting new development.” There are those, I guess, who would call that informed optimism, but I take a more free market perspective. I don’t believe the public should be burdened with the costs of my hopes. I believe that if I want to improve my neighborhood, I should do so a bit at a time, with small business loans, outreach through residents, businesses, and existing organizations. I look at Atlanta’s love affair with developers and TADs and I look at its almost chronic budget shortfalls, at its embarrassing lack of the basics, at its overwhelmed police department and emergency services, and I see a city that thinks it can build its future by ignoring its present morass.
Stephanie
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 8:11 AM
Dear Stephanie:
Have you commented on Sunday Paper web pages using the pseudonym Lazarus?
You have an ethical obligation to Sunday Paper readers to answer the question directly and honestly.
http://tinyurl.com/kjnexy
Andisheh Nouraee
andy@andy2000.org
Andisheh
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 9:12 AM
1--Sunday Paper readers couldn't give less of a damn.
2--Consider this, Andi, whatever the case may be, why would anyone answer that question when by not answering that question we can all sit back and watch you spiral into insanity?
Stephanie
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 9:27 AM
i read the SP and would be interested in the answer.
thanks
jeff
jeff
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 9:38 AM
My concern, the concern that drove me to post this blog entry and the one that guides much of my writing, is that the police are once again being used for the benefit of the City of Atlanta’s officials and their cronies. If that is not the case, it is not the case, but I have the same right, as any citizen does, to ask a question about something that doesn’t look right to me.
The political relationship between the city government and developers cannot and should not be discounted. Equally important is the city’s historic use of the police department to balance its books. When these two factors are taken together, my worry regarding cops being channeled toward the Beltline TAD is more than justified.
What is particularly sad about Andisheh Nouraee’s obsession with a blog comment made in November 2008 (here is the thing to which he is referring, http://www.sundaypaper.com/More/Archives/tabid/98/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/3375/Default.aspx) is that if Nouraee, who is a columnist for our ailing competitor, Creative Loafing, had devoted half as much passion and dedication to covering a local issue as he has to that comment, the local issue probably would have been resolved by now.
What is particularly sad about Creative Loafing’s role in this is that it used to be the paper that could always sniff out when developers were using some supposedly civic-minded project to promote their own interests. It did a better job of exposing those scenarios than any publication I have ever seen. I am, as most folks know, a former Creative Loafing staff writer, but I usually didn’t cover development so I’m certainly not talking about myself.
Today’s CL, however, is the biggest booster of the Beltline in Atlanta’s media.
The Sunday Paper takes no position on the Beltline. I, for the record, am not a fan of the Beltline. When I consider the many millions of dollars that have been sunk into it, the vast quantities of media attention and public energy that have been expended on it, I feel sick to my stomach. However inspiring Ryan Gravel’s dream is, and it is, the fact is that Atlanta has desperately needed those resources for the basics: police, fire, garbage pick up, maintained streets, and a reliable and efficient water system. However much its fans cheer that the Beltline has fed on private money, their jubilation is produced by ignoring how much the city has outright given developers by exonerating them from taxes and fees over and over again. The city hasn’t even collected impact fees on many of the projects going on within it. That is money that could have been put to much better use in the here and now rather than on a transit loop that won’t be completed for 25 years. If transit is the issue, then expanding MARTA would be a much smarter way to go.
A TAD is an exercise in indebtedness. According to the Atlanta Development Authority, in a TAD “redevelopment costs are financed through the pledge of future incremental increases in property taxes generated by the resulting new development.” There are those, I guess, who would call that informed optimism, but I take a more free market perspective. I don’t believe the public should be burdened with the costs of my hopes. I believe that if I want to improve a neighborhood, I should do so a bit at a time, with small business loans, outreach through residents, businesses, and existing organizations. I look at Atlanta’s love affair with TADs and I look at its almost chronic budget shortfalls, at its embarrassing lack of the basics, at its overwhelmed police department and emergency services, and I see a city that thinks it can build its future by ignoring its present morass.
Stephanie
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 9:42 AM
sorry, i meant did you post using Lazarus?
thanks again
jeff
jeff
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 9:46 AM
Creative Loafing has a responsibility to its readers to tell us who is "Mr. T."
I occassionally read Creative Loafing. I would like to know.
--Thank you, Steph
Stephanie
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 9:48 AM
I give a damn. Have you posted using the name Lazarus?
susan
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 9:49 AM
Creative Loafing has a responsibility to its readers to tell us who is "Mr. T."
I occassionally read Creative Loafing. I would like to know.
I would also like to know Susan and Jeff's full names. I would also like to know "Joe"'s full name and the name of everyone who has ever posted to my blog or any other blog in town.
But I do not have that right, and a publication does not have the right to divulge that information.
If you're my readers, great, welcome. But I do not owe you that information.
--Thank you, Steph
Stephanie
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 9:56 AM
Jeff Elkins
(couldn't you get that from my registration?)
jeff
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 10:06 AM
I thought you said you knew who I am...
The CL news writers (and many others around town) know who i am and can say with certainty that I do not work there nor have I ever.
You are the one who used anonymity to personally attack someone, Steph (may I call you Steph? It makes us sound so friendly. You can call me Mr. if you like).
I questioned your professionalism based on your use of innuendo, conspiracy theory and loose relationships to smear a good organization (Police Foundation) and a developer that has done much good in this city (Cousins: see East Lake and Downtown revitalizations). Are either perfect? No chance. But in this case, the facts do not support your accusation.
Also, you should own up to the Lazarus thing. It will make you feel better. Why go into the weekend all down?
Mr. T
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 10:12 AM
No problem, Denis. I was just being my usual snarky self.
Now as to this...
"I would also like to know "Joe"'s full name"
Actually I'm pretty sure Joe told you his name.
And there's a big difference between a random commenter using a pseudo-anonymous web handle and a journalist actively engaging in sock puppetry on his or her own publications site.
Big difference
~griftdrift
James
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 10:12 AM
Stephanie Rampage wrote: "My concern, the concern that drove me to post this blog entry and the one that guides much of my writing, is that the police are once again being used for the benefit of the City of Atlanta’s officials and their cronies."
I wish the City of Atlanta used me in the same fashion and give me access to affordable housing in the TAD. I doubt the police officers are complaining.
Unless we can connect the dots (with lines not fuzzy speculation), I don't see this being such a big deal. Unless the money going to the affordable housing is a drain on the city budget, but that will take more work to find out.
Denis
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 10:39 AM
Denis,
I seriously doubt you want the city to use you. But if so, just go down and fill out an application. Mayor wants 100+ officers now, and you can jump right into one of the "affordable" housings offered.
As for the rest of you, I feel like we are in kindergarten. Or better yet my 3 and 4 year old yelling. Whatever happened a year ago, is it pertinent now? Don't see it. If Mr. T is such a great and dedicated journalist, then please write a story rebutting all of this and have it posted all across the grand city. Stephanie has actually stood up for a lot of what is wrong for this city in an attempt to make it better for those that live and work here from where I stand. She has taken heat from the mayor and others because insead of standing there watching things, she has written and questioned it. I don't know all the facts surrounding what she just wrote about, but it sounds like something which at least warrants a second look and an explaination. So, how about a discussion about it instead of childish name calling so those of us who might want to learn more can do so instead of being turned off by this? Or would you rather just be more of the problem and not the solution?
rob
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 5:11 PM
Always a good idea to appeal to our better angels, Rob.
That said, I never claimed to be a great journalist. I am not one. But it took exactly five minutes for me to pull a map of the Beltline and a list of properties owned by Cousins, review them and recognize that Cousins has ZERO invested in the Beltline's success.
That fact alone eliminates the basis of Stephanie's inflammatory question. It was irresponsible.
In any case, the onus is not on me to prove/disprove anything. She made the accusation...she needs to provide the evidence. A four-year-old story made up entirely of circumstantial relationships is not evidence. It's just more supposition.
Mr. T
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 10:58 PM
Hey everyone, get a load of what Mr. T says is a map of the proposed tracts of Beltline parcels:
http://www.beltline.org/Portals/26/project_overview_062008.pdf
Mr. T, honey ('cause we're friends, right?) You actually think these are plats? Seriously? Have you ever been to a deed room? In your life? I thought you said you knew a helluva lot about real estate.
And that bit about "here are Counsins Properties"? Those are "tables" that "set forth certain information related to significant operating properties in which the Company has an ownership interest. Information presented in Note 5 to the Consolidated Financial Statements provides additional information related to the Company’s joint ventures. All information presented is as of December 31, 2008. Dollars are stated in thousands."
Those are "operating properties." They are properties that are already producing income. They are not undeveloped parcels.
Don't ever use unspecified web links to try and prop yourself up on this blog again. True, most of these people are so eager to attack me, they wouldn't even think of clicking on the links to check you, but I did and it showed you to be an absolute fraud.
Nighty night.
Stephanie
Friday, August 07, 2009 at 11:26 PM
OK, I am confused. Mr.T, you said, "I am just a former and future journalist who happens to know a hell of a lot about real estate". So are you a journalist or not? I am just curious as I am not privy to the whole group that is on here but it sounded like you were a journalist. I would like to know where you wrote so I can see the writing you do. And if you know a hell of a lot about real estate (I don't and I won't claim to) it really only takes 5 minutes to find all of this? I am looking for land now and the real estate agent I am using has taken 3 weeks to track down the bank which now owns the land I am looking at. (Seems it has been foreclosed on, then taken over by a bank, which in turn went under also) And are there any other companies related to or part of Cousins which might have holdings? Or maybe a private person associated with any of this mess who is part of this? I would think even with all the resourses possible it would take A LOT longer than just 5 minutes and one web site to get to the bottom of it all. Again, I don't know, but I think it is a very good question to bring up and investigate further before just attacking Stephanie or any other groups for asking it. And I would also think that the ferocity of the attack against her would lead me to actually think there is more to this story than just the story alone led me to believe.
rob
Saturday, August 08, 2009 at 11:52 AM
And on and on. Wouldn't it be easier if you just worked on proving your accusations against Cousins and APF? All this time you're spending deflecting could be spent exposing Cousins, which according to your innuendo is lying to the SEC about its land holdings. Just a suggestion.
Now, I didn't say the Beltline map had anything to do with a plat map or specific tracts. (Aside - nice attempt to get jargony with your "plats" and "deed room" talk. I have forgotten more about commercial real estate than you will ever know). It shows the path and therefore gives us a guide to identify if Cousins has purchased anything close to the path. We can do this because the link I provided does in fact list all operating properties - as you've stated - AND ALL LAND INVENTORY HELD FOR FUTURE DEVELOPMENT. Scroll down to page 26 and it says:
Land Held
As of December 31, 2008, the Company owned or controlled the following land holdings either directly or indirectly through venture arrangements. The Company evaluates its land holdings on a regular basis and may develop, ground lease or sell portions of the land holdings if opportunities arise. Information in the table represents total amounts for the developable land area as a whole, not the Company’s share, and for cost basis, reflects the venture’s basis, if applicable. See Note 5 of Notes to Consolidated Financial Statements in Item 8 of this report for further information related to investments in unconsolidated joint ventures.
In case you're not clear on what this list contains, it is all non-income producing land the company holds for potential development or sale. All publicly traded real estate firms must disclose ALL holdings, not just operating properties.
A review of that list compared with the Beltline map makes it clear that Cousins owns no land near the path of the Beltline.
So we're back to your original argument that Cousins is part of a shadowy cabal that would never actually disclose its land holdings even though it is compelled by the federal gov't to do so.
Or that Cousins is "behind" the Beltline even though it has made zero attempt to benefit financially from it. I think people who are "behind" projects when they don't stand to benefit directly could simply be called supporters.
For the record, I am also "behind" the Beltline because i think it has the potential to generate development in parts of the city that dearly need investment. Guess my support makes me worthy of some smear too.
Mr. T
Saturday, August 08, 2009 at 12:03 PM
It's important to remember that this whole Beltline thing involves a train going around Atlanta. I think that's a good idea, transportation-wise.
I have cousins that I would like to see use this Beltline when they visit, because I strongly feel that it would be an easier form of transportation than the alternative...Horses.
In Memory of John Hughes, I would like to include to this argument some dialogue from one of his more popular films, "Ferris Bueller's Day Off":
"I do have a test today, that wasn't bullshit. It's on European socialism. I mean, really, what's the point? I'm not European. I don't plan on being European. So who gives a crap if they're socialists? They could be fascist anarchists, it still doesn't change the fact that I don't own a car."
Amen Ferris, Amen. And if this Beltline thing happens, who's to say that Ferris would be so bummed about needing a car anyway? I'd like to think we'd all be a little better off if Ferris could get around easier.
I'm pretty sure since that movie was made Chicago got a beltline transportation system. So I propose we make a coming of age teenage comedy set in Atlanta to help further the investment of Police Cousin's agenda at finishing the Beltline.
Because isn't that REALLY what this is all about?
David
Saturday, August 08, 2009 at 12:45 PM
It's always worth asking questions about connections between City Hall policies and developers in Atlanta. I can't believe that anybody who writes about the city wouldn't know that to be pretty much the first rule in Atlanta.
There has not been a single community development program in Atlanta in the last thirty years (and the Beltline is community development) that has not succumbed to grotesque, systematic corruption. Without exception, these projects are mere plumbing constructed to conduit other people's tax dollars to politically connected, golf, white, giant flower, and grey-collar criminals.
Non-profits are also some of the most questionable games in town. In any town.
This article:
http://www.chicagoreader.com/chicago/mr-big-spender-daleys-central-loop-tif-binge/Content?oid=1173292
clarifies, for me, a lot of what is wrong with schemes like the Beltway. It's a nice idea, but with Atlanta's history, the pressures already imposed on a finite pool of taxpayers, and the skimming that pretty much defines the Mayor's office, I couldn't support it. Nor did anybody ever explain to me how it was going to improve the city's dire transportation issues, particularly those on in-town surface roads.
Tina
Thursday, August 13, 2009 at 1:29 PM
I'm amazed at the developer allies who showed up here to attack Stephanie for pointing out the cozy interlocking nature of how Atlanta is run - in this case that the Police Foundation is chaired by a big developer and is touting affordable housing for cops.
Conflicts of interest are rampant in this town - look at Borders who had the brass nerve to combine her Cousins job as VP of Govt Affrs with being Council President. No, they don't advertise how they've benefited from their insider status and we rarely find out. The Wayne Mason scandal still has not been fully unravelled: whom did he pay off to get the sweet deal he extorted? Caveat elector is the first principle - regrettably never observed around here.
On the substance of the blog, housing: if the market worked then condo prices in the city would likely fall to the point where lower-paid folks like cops could afford the payments, assuming they are ready to settle for high-rise living rather than the 'burb dream. Yet banks prefer to hold out and not recognize how little empty condo buildings on which they have lent are worth. Otherwise such banks would go the way that Colonial Bank (AL) went last week - equity wiped out.
Does anyone deserving actually get the much-trumpeted affordable housing, of which there never is very much? I've heard that those who apply and who qualify based on modest income get the run around, not the keys. Presumably, you'd need to be very well-connected to gain an under-priced, rationed asset.
Interestingly John McColl is Hugh McColl's son, Hugh being the whizz who assembled Nationsbank and then grabbed Bank of America. Wonder how many bad real estate loans that monster has on its books? How many on developments that Cousins put together? (BoA is so huge that Cousins business would be a rounding error, but still an intriguing question.
Julian
Wednesday, August 19, 2009 at 2:36 PM
The northern most tip of the BeltLine TAD is the intersection of Piedmont and Peachtree, the same intersection as Terminus 100 and 200, two trophy projects of Cousins.
Folks, please labor under the facts.
Dave
Sunday, August 23, 2009 at 7:06 PM